Comments on: A Case for Higher Education

By: henryjz

henryjz — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 21:36:20 +0000

thanks for your input!

By: jcisonline

jcisonline — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:18:56 +0000

well I got my "higher education" in Marketing. Here is the way that I would talk about it and this is kinda how I feel with most education that most of your app type learning happens in high school and beyond. So if you don't enjoy science, english, math, reading, or athletics then most of the time there is nothing for you until high school and beyond.

So to me all of your "higher education" happens after high school whether you went to a college or not. But I know that my college experience has benefited me a ton in ministry. Communication, production, and branding are just a few of the things that have been enhanced for me because of school. But more than anything by going to a liberal school I experienced people in a brand new way. God grew me more thru stories of people and dialogue with people with much much much different views than I. But God taught me to love others more than I have ever before in my life.

Last thing. School is like everything else, it's what you make of it. Just because you were there doesn't mean u got anything out of it.

Great post and cool comment dialogue!

By: Matt Guevara

Matt Guevara — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 02:44:47 +0000

I think the value of Bethel's program (which is my only higher education experience) is that I was allowed to participate while doing full-time ministry. It took longer than a traditional program, but I think I learned a heckuva lot more. In my experience in non-denomination and Pentecostal churches, education does not bring greater respect. However, many – many – many times, children's and family ministry leaders are not allowed or welcome to the leadership table because they lack educational credentials (for good or for ill). Of course, I realize that not all people can undertake a seminary experience, but Bethel's program in particular was not about what we are supposed to know to be a better leader but how to learn and teach what we don't know.
Matt

By: Henry Zonio

Henry Zonio — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 23:00:45 +0000

I'm just glad that God can use us all whether we are educated or not. I've had the privilege of working with some very gifted people on either end of the spectrum. Thanks Dave for contributing!

By: Dave

Dave — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 19:13:26 +0000

Of course, you're talking to someone who home schools all four of my kids because I believe, overall, our education system gets a major #fail. Just so you know what kind of strong bias I have

One other comment – Jesus taught certainly taught his disciples, but does that mean that short of being taught by Jesus or in seminary, that we can't be effective ministers or disciples? One other problem with seminarians is the tendency to elevate them to a different status of disciple or kingdom role, which goes against much of what the reformers were about in deconstructing the catholic priesthood. We say we believe in a priesthood of believers, yet we evangelicals hire our own priesthood to take official roles that we assume unlearned, ordinary folk can't handle. Minor case-in-point: How many churches have a stated policy that only their ordained ministers can marry or baptize congregants? Where does this come from?

My point would be that many of the finest, wisest, servant leaders I know are those who are "ordinary" folk, self-taught and taught within the give and take of scripture lived out in community, not those taught within a formal systematic theology.

Thanks for the thread, Matt.

By: Henry Zonio

Henry Zonio — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:28:02 +0000

I've run into those same people who are useless with a seminary degree, but more often than not my experience has been that those with higher education degrees tend to be more articulate and well versed about what they do and why. There are always those people who love to learn and continue learning with or without a degree. I think, though, that we've beat up too much on higher education in church world. Yes, there were the disciples who were unschooled when Jesus called them, but he taught them. And let's not forget the one person who contributed most of the New Testament, Paul, who was one of the most schooled people there was. I'm just saying that we need to stop beating up on higher education and advocate and both/and approach: education and experience.

By: Dave

Dave — Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:11:35 +0000

Wow, as a guy who loves to learn, but never finished a higher-ed degree, I'd probably disagree with you somewhat. My personal experience with many guys with seminary degrees is that they tend to think "inside" the box. There is a theology and methodology that is passed as tradition from instructor to student over generations that tends to pigeon-hole ministers into ways of thinking that are incredibly hard for them to move out of. How many guys have you seen or heard, straight out of seminary say, "Gee, they never taught us this in seminary."

Jesus' disciples were unschooled, ordinary men who had been with Jesus. I take some comfort in that when I'm sitting among my fellow staff members, two of whom work and teach at a seminary, and all of whom (except me), who have MDiv's or PhD's.

My $.02